Copstick, oft called a horned beast, proves the point
In 2011 at the Edinburgh Fringe, I chaired two debates about the comedy business and arranged two spaghetti-juggling contests; the latter could be seen as a simile for the former.
At the 2013 Fringe, I chaired five chat shows on comedy-related subjects. Most included comedy critic Kate Copstick.
Throughout the 2014 Fringe, Copstick and I chaired The Grouchy Club, in which there were no guests. We (well, to be honest, mostly she) chatted to the audience and it was mostly but (like this blog) not entirely about the comedy business.
Yesterday, Copstick and I recorded the first in a weekly series of Grouchy Club “mostly comedy” podcasts.
I suggested we should start off these weekly chats simply – with just us alone in an empty room and no audience because of the audio distraction. So we decided to record the first podcast at Copstick’s Mama Biashara charity shop in London’s Shepherd’s Bush because it was a controllable space and, on a Sunday, closed.
So we thought.
In fact, the shop was open and, on a Sunday, has a music tradition. So there is an African drummer rather distractingly plying his art over the first 16 minutes of the 43 minute recording available online at http://thegrouchyclub.podomatic.com
The subjects covered include: sexism, the controversial comedians Dapper Laughs and Andrew Lawrence, why ITV’s Show Me The Funny comedy talent show was crap, Copstick’s encounters with criminals, rape victims, police corruption, and the comedy industry’s new ’political correctness’ Fascists… Oh!… and Copstick sings.
The audio podcast is 43 minutes long. We also videoed the chat and I have posted a single 10-minute chunk of the podcast on YouTube.
Serious stuff: The Grouchy Club podcast recording yesterday.
There will be a live Grouchy Club show next Sunday as part of the Jewish Comedy Day in London, despite the fact neither of us is Jewish.
And The Grouchy Club returns to the Edinburgh Fringe this August.
Below are two low-key excerpts from yesterday’s podcast. You will have to listen to the original to get the fully venomous rants.
COPSTICK
Have you looked recently at any of the comedy forums? They are all grouchier than me.
JOHN
No-one is grouchier than you. Adolf Hitler was not grouchier than you.
COPSTICK
To be fair, OK, I am grouchy. But comedy recently, I think, has just become so fucking judgemental.
JOHN
It’s always been judgemental. You’re a critic.
COPSTICK
But I’m fairly and intelligently judgemental… I mean, look at what has happened. Currently we have questions being asked in the House of Commons because Channel 4 want to do a sitcom based on the Irish Potato Famine. Because, apparently, you’re not allowed to be funny about the Irish Potato Famine.
That is two steps away from creating a jihad because someone has drawn a moustache and a pair of funny specs on the face of the prophet Mohammed – who probably had a moustache anyway, to be fair.
JOHN
We should point out this is being recorded the day after people were shot to death in Denmark for daring to speak things.
COPSTICK
Exactly! That’s what I’m saying. No, it’s not what I’m saying! People within the comedy industry seem to be becoming as judgemental as people outside the industry. I mean, when was the last time ever, in comedy – the answer is never…
JOHN
Never.
COPSTICK
Too soon.
JOHN
Timing.
COPSTICK
Essence… Comedy.
JOHN
42.
COPSTICK
We’re not talking universe here, we’re talking something much more important, John: we’re talking Comedy.
JOHN
I should point out that, when I arrived, Copstick said (a) I’m very angry and (b) I’m pissed. She is. Not me.
COPSTICK
Well, I was angry.
JOHN
And pissed.
COPSTICK
No, no, no. I was angry, I was in pain (Copstick has lupus), I was upset, I was depressed and I was frustrated.
JOHN
Ideal for an Edinburgh comedy show.
COPSTICK
And then my lovely volunteer here in the Mama Biashara shop suggested Southern Comfort but we didn’t have any Southern Comfort, so I fell back on Jägermeister and I can’t tell you how warm and cuddly and friendly I’m feeling… Except to the people in the comedy industry who have suddenly turned into the Spanish fucking Inquisition.
Back to my question. Whenever in the history of comedy did people from within the industry turn on one of their own and kill… I’m talking Dapper Laughs.
JOHN
But he has revived, like the good lord on the third day.
COPSTICK
I’m speaking now as somebody who I think we can all agree… Look, it’s been some time since I’ve been well-moist. I think I’m sticky at best, crusty at worst… But what is wrong with Dapper Laughs? It wasn’t the greatest comedy series on television, but…
JOHN
We should point out to any foreign listeners that happen to be out there that Dapper Laughs was said to be a sexist and…
COPSTICK
He WAS sexist! He IS sexist. But what’s wrong with comedy sexism?
JOHN
Sexism is a bit like making jokes about rape. In theory, you shouldn’t make jokes about rape, but it depends how it’s done.
COPSTICK
Exactly…Well, no… I don’t think it is. Because rape is a terrible thing, despite what some people who subscribe to your blog might think that I think. Rape is a terrible thing. It’s an act of aggression; it’s an act of violence. Sexism is just making fun of different sexes in the ways that they are different.
JOHN
That’s comedy sexism. But sexism is actually demeaning someone else.
COPSTICK
But he IS comedy sexism.
JOHN
But it’s like saying there’s nothing wrong with racism. There is nothing wrong with jokes about people of another race, but there is something wrong with racism, where you say that person is not worthy of anything and should be spat upon. Women are pointless, they’re awful, they’re mentally inferior…
COPSTICK
That’s not what he said.
JOHN
That’s sexism, though.
COPSTICK
Yes, but that’s not what he said,
JOHN
You did an ITV1 comedy talent show.
COPSTICK
Yes, it was called Show Me The Funny and it didn’t. It hardly showed any funny, because it was too busy wandering off round Liverpool watching people trying to find somebody called Michelle.
JOHN
Without slagging off anyone or causing a legal rumpus, why did they do that?
COPSTICK
Well, without slagging off anyone or causing a legal rumpus…
JOHN
We both know the executive producer, who is wonderful.
COPSTICK
He is a marvellous man. As I understand it… and let me preface this by saying that, if anyone in ITV1 would like to offer me a comedy series, I would be only too happy to say Yes… However, what seems to me to have been the problem with Show Me The Funny was that somebody said: Let’s do X-Factor for comedy. and they went: Great! Fucking hell! Nice! Yes!
However, at the point where they take a good or reasonable or very basic idea to a boardroom where lots of pointless executives sit around, they then said: Yes, X-Factor. Huge! Marvellous! Everyone loves it! But The Apprentice is really good too and it gets fantastic ratings. So why don’t we just… In a criminal enterprise, this would be called a cut-and-shunt.
JOHN
Shunt?
COPSTICK
Shunt.
JOHN
Just checking.
COPSTICK
Rhyming with… It means you take the back half of one (car) and the front half of another, slam them together and hope that it works. Guess what. It didn’t.
They had a choice: take the entire production team from the entertainment show or take the entire production team from The Apprentice. And guess what they did. They took the entire fucking production team from The Apprentice. How funny was The Apprentice? Not at all.
JOHN
That’s literally true, isn’t it? They came from The Apprentice.
COPSTICK
That is true. Lovely people. But about as funny as genital herpes.
JOHN
It’s very difficult to do a comedy show or a light entertainment show if you don’t have the light entertainment gene.
COPSTICK
Very sweet people but… bloody hell!
YOU HEAR THE FULL PODCAST HERE
AND WATCH A 10-MINUTE SECTION OF VIDEO HERE
SO IT GOES - John Fleming's blog 
I really liked Show Me the Funny. I thought ‘Oh there’s the fella that does warm up for Paul O’Grady, and tried to give away my purple Doc Martin’s to Jo Brand.’ I also thought, I wish the performance part of the show was longer. I hadn’t seen any stand up, apart from Billy Connolly, and didn’t realise that was what he was doing. I just thought he told good stories, and wondered at his ability to tell them. I went to a comedy club for the first time ever, some time after that, and found that I liked it, and wanted to see more.